random library: Request for Carter Tazio Schonwald (@cartazio) to step down as maintainer with immediate effect
Mathieu Boespflug
m at tweag.io
Fri Jun 5 12:31:18 UTC 2020
Zemyla,
I would expect more charitable reception of anything said by anyone, but especially when the original author stated clearly in the very same message that they are not a native English speaker. And even if the words are to be taken on face value, do note that no one has called anyone a tyrant. Calling out specific behaviour (that predates the current pandemic) as "tyrannous" (or "tyrannical") and naming someone a tyrant is simply not the same thing.
On Fri, Jun 05, 2020 at 13:06:20, Zemyla < zemyla at gmail.com > wrote:
>
> So you're saying that the fact that there's basically a civil war and
> pandemic going on is no excuse to respond to e-mails. And you're calling
> his behavior "tyrannous" when there are literal tyrants shooting tear gas
> at civilians.
>
>
>
> I gotta admit, this makes me disinclined to believe you're acting in good
> faith. Sometimes shit happens to good people, and someone who can't show a
> little compassion in these (pardon the cliche) unprecedented times is not
> someone I want anywhere involved in package management.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 5, 2020, 02:18 Fumiaki Kinoshita < fumiexcel@ gmail. com (
> fumiexcel at gmail.com ) > wrote:
>
>
>> For example video call is not a great method for me because of the
>> following reasons:
>>
>>
>>
>> * I'm not a good English speaker (especially I sometimes have difficulty
>> with colloquial American English)
>>
>> * I live in a different timezone
>>
>> * I prefer open communication
>>
>>
>>
>> Although it's totally fine that you have a preference, I have no doubt
>> that core library maintenance should have more acceptance and
>> transparency.
>>
>>
>>
>> I hesitated talking about this because issues might get
>> locked/edited/deleted, and the participants might get accused of being
>> "thick headed assholes" again like you did in https:/ / github. com/ haskell/
>> vector/ issues/ 267#issuecomment-579588727 (
>> https://github.com/haskell/vector/issues/267#issuecomment-579588727 ) , but
>> I must say:
>>
>> Frankly, it feels extremely unfair that you ask us to focus on "technical
>> matters" (which excludes maintenance for some reason) only, while you
>> frequently use non-technical reasons (your diseases and the situation in
>> New York) as an excuse. Your asthma doesn't rub me in the wrong way; your
>> tyrannous behaviour does. With all due respect I suggest you not to use
>> CLC privileges to cope with your personal stresses.
>>
>>
>>
>> 2020年6月5日(金) 7:29 Carter Schonwald < carter. schonwald@ gmail. com (
>> carter.schonwald at gmail.com ) >:
>>
>>
>>> and more details to follow in a few days, i'm pretty fried, there was a
>>> police shooting this morning 1 block from my aparment plus a whole mess of
>>> stuff going on in lowermanhattan where i live most of the time this week
>>> thats got me on edge and stressed out of my gourd.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 6:24 PM Carter Schonwald < carter. schonwald@ gmail.
>>> com ( carter.schonwald at gmail.com ) > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> i've added a few folks at uploader/contributor bits, and this is generally
>>>> something all core libraries need. i really prefer discussion via video
>>>> call or voice chat or 1-1 neutral language..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> yesterday i was pretty laid up with some pretty bad asthma etc and allergy
>>>> drugs, and I'm sorry if that rubbed you the wrong way .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 4:50 AM Profpatsch < mail@ profpatsch. de (
>>>> mail at profpatsch.de ) > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> chessai . < chessai1996@ gmail. com ( chessai1996 at gmail.com ) > writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > Yes, please contact me about these concerns. I am reachable via email at
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > chessai1996@ gmail. com ( chessai1996 at gmail.com ).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Great, I’m looking forward to seeing this matter resolved swiftly.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I am a fan of discussing community matters openly, but everybody can
>>>>>
>>>>> of course decide whether they want to speak up publicly or privately
>>>>>
>>>>> talk to a trustee.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 12:24 PM David Feuer < david. feuer@ gmail. com (
>>>>> david.feuer at gmail.com ) > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> >> I urge everyone to direct all further comments on this topic to the
>>>>>
>>>>> >> current chair of the CLC. There is nothing to be gained from public
>>>>>
>>>>> >> discussion of a "personnel" matter.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>
>>>>>
>>>>> >> On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 10:03 AM Profpatsch < mail@ profpatsch. de (
>>>>> mail at profpatsch.de ) > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> >>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> I posted this comment on the thread of
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> https:/ / github. com/ haskell/ random/ pull/ 62#issuecomment-638088258
>>>>> ( https://github.com/haskell/random/pull/62#issuecomment-638088258 )
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> Since it was deleted and the comment thread locked by Carter,
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> I am escalating this request to the mailing list, where it cannot be
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> deleted.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> Profpatsch < notifications@ github. com ( notifications at github.com ) >
>>>>> writes:
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> > @cartazio Please take even a fleeting look at
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> https:/ / github. com/ idontgetoutmuch/ random/ pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aclosed
>>>>> ( https://github.com/idontgetoutmuch/random/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aclosed ) ,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> notice the amount of discussion and the timeline.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> > This is the full-time work of a team of half a dozen of experts,
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> probably breaching one man-year of effort, easily.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> > It cannot just be discarded out of hand.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> > I have been following the discussions (spread over mailinglists,
>>>>> issue
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> trackers and elsewhere), and I propose you hand over maintainership of
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> `random` as a base package.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> A parallel issue with relevant discussion can be found at
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> https:/ / github. com/ haskell/ random/ pull/ 61 (
>>>>> https://github.com/haskell/random/pull/61 )
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> I am writing this email from my personal account, because I fear for
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> the health of the Haskell ecosystem, and I think Carter’s behaviour is
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> extremely detrimental to it.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> I think a lot of other people feel the same way, so I encourage you to
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> add your voice publicly.
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> ~ Profpatsch
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> Libraries mailing list
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> Libraries@ haskell. org ( Libraries at haskell.org )
>>>>>
>>>>> >>> http:/ / mail. haskell. org/ cgi-bin/ mailman/ listinfo/ libraries (
>>>>> http://mail.haskell.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/libraries )
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>> >>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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>>
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