[Haskell-cafe] Time for a new logo?

Jonathan Cast jonathanccast at fastmail.fm
Tue Dec 16 16:20:41 EST 2008

On Tue, 2008-12-16 at 20:23 +0000, Andrew Coppin wrote:
> Malcolm Wallace wrote:
> > Andrew Coppin <andrewcoppin at btinternet.com> wrote:
> >
> >   
> >> To him, apparently, the current logo says "Haskell is all
> >> about  arcane and obscure mathematical constructs. In fact, we think
> >> that  complicated mathematics is so good that we stuffed our logo full
> >> of it.  If you don't like hard math, don't even bother trying to learn
> >> this  language."
> >>     
> >
> > I think he got the right idea (kind of).  To him, mathematics is arcane,
> > but to Haskellers it is the fundamental basis of computation.  If
> > someone is not prepared to invest in learning the foundations of the
> > subject of Computer Science, then they have no business becoming a
> > programmer.
> >
> > We really must get away from the idea that programming is something any
> > old fool should be able to pick up.  Programming correct software is
> > hard, and it requires a mathematical mind.
> >   
> I think the accusation is more that Haskell tries to be cryptic and 
> arcane *on purpose*, just to confuse people.
> Sure, there are many concepts in Haskell which just aren't found 
> anywhere else. But monads? Catamorphisms? Coroutines? Couldn't we think 
> up some less intimidating terminology?

If we thought up that terminology, that would be a legitimate complaint.

But we didn't; we're just trying to honor our fore-bearers by using
their terminology and crediting them when we use their ideas.

> {-# LANGUAGE ExistentialQuantification #-}
> Hmm, now if this was Perl or something, that would be 
> HiddenTypeVariables or something. Much less fearsom-sounding.

No, it's cute.  Repulsively so.

> But then, I guess that's what you get for a lanuage designed by a 
> committee of university professors. ;-)
> At any rate, if we're to have a logo, let's not have one which actively 
> *promotes* the notion that Haskell is complex and difficult and that 
> only theoretical physicists need apply...

I'd like to hold out, again, for the idea that we get a higher-quality
community by promoting that notion.


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