[Haskell-cafe] Consensus about databases / serialization
cristian.baboi at gmail.com
Wed Jan 2 09:18:19 EST 2008
I recommend you read "Extending the database relational model to capture
more meaning" by E.F. Codd.
On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 13:50:46 +0200, Peter Verswyvelen <bf3 at telenet.be>
> As I'm a selfmade man, I never really studied relational databases in
> detail. My intuition told me that the "relational" part was not really
> suitable for the 3D data, 2D images, animation curves, state machines,
> other data I encountered in the videogame and animation business. I could
> always get away with files, and for the applications I needed to deploy,
> plugging in a couple of extra gigabytes of RAM and serializing the
> state to disk was more practical, cheaper and faster.
> However, a couple of years ago I started studying computer science (I
> to do the theory after the practice, weird behavior ;-) at the Open
> University, and one of the exams I did was about databases. Initially
> course convinced me that databases are actually very nice, but the course
> ended with a topic on object oriented databases, which were designed to
> storing data like "3D models, graphs, networks, and complex
> more practical. Duh.
> Since then, I did deploy a few commercial applications for customers
> databases, which worked fine for the typical "simple/flat" database
> data. I
> hated embedding a dynamic untyped language like SQL, as much as I hated
> embedding code in HTML or XML. IMHO it feels UGLY and unsafe. Regarding
> other popular data storage format - XML - I did use that a lot, but it
> like going back to the stone ages, when hierarchical stores/databases got
> invented (and ditched?)
> Now, initially after an introduction to Microsoft's LINQ, and recently
> having read a very brief overview of HAppS, it seems I'm not the only one
> with those "feelings".
> Ouch, this introduction got way to long, sorry about that ;-)
> Finally some practical questions:
> . regarding Haskell and databases, the page
> describes a few, but which are the ones that are stable and practical?
> user experiences?
> . HApps is not listed in the page above, because it does not use
> databases? Is HApps reliable or experimental, and does it scale well? Any
> success stories?
> . regarding Haskell and serialization, I don't think that
> implementing Read/Show is a good way for real serialization, so what
> options exist? I could find some libraries at
> http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/pkg-list.html#cat:Data, but
> again which are the most practical and stable? When programming in
> and C#/.NET, I tended to develop my own serialization frameworks because
> used that for many things, like logging commands to disk, performing
> undo/redo, intra and inter process cut/copy/paste, save/load, etc.
> . Regarding serialization, I'm kinda curious how ADTs and even
> are stored and retrieved in a relational database? I guess it could be
> using BLOBs and serialization to ByteStrings, so bypassing a lot of the
> database table structures?
> . If I would want to experiment with say HAppS, the way I
> it, I first would first have to study "Scratch your boilerplate" and
> Template Haskell, and maybe some other language features? I'm still new
> Haskell, and the road to understanding all language elements and
> is very long, so sequentially learning it would be insane I guess. I
> have no
> practical experience with TH, but I spent a long time trying to do
> oriented programming" in C# without success, so TH looks uber to me.
> Thanks a lot and best wishes for 2008?
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