[Haskell-cafe] Re: anybody can tell me the pronuncation of?"haskell"?

[Benjamin L. Russell]

According to the "Gogen Yurai Jiten" (Etymology
Derivation Dictionary")
(http://gogen-allguide.com/a/arigatou.html), the
etymology of "arigato" ("arigatou" when entered into a
Japanese input method editor, such as Kotoeri) is as
follows (at the risk of moji-bake (garbled text), I
have included the Japanese text in Japanese characters
before each translated portion):

- translated text follows immediately after this line
-
‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚¤‚̌ꌹ‚́AŒ`—eŽŒu—L‚è“i‚ ‚肪‚½‚µjv‚̘A—pŒ`u—L‚è“ï‚­i‚ ‚肪‚½‚­jv‚ªƒE‰¹•Ö‰»‚µA‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚¤‚Æ‚È‚Á‚½B

The etymology of "arigatou" is that the te-form
[loosely translated as "conjunctive form"] "arigataku"
of the adjective "arigatashi" changed in form to end
in the "u" sound, and became "arigatou."

u—L‚è“i‚ ‚肪‚½‚µjv‚́Au—L‚éi‚ ‚éj‚±‚Ɓv‚ªu“ï‚¢i‚©‚½‚¢jv‚Æ‚¢‚¤ˆÓ–¡‚ŁA–{—ˆ‚́u–Å‘½‚É‚È‚¢v‚âu’¿‚µ‚­‚Ä‹Md‚¾v‚Æ‚¢‚¤ˆÓ–¡‚ð•\‚µ‚½B

"Arigatashi" has the meaning of "being" being
"rare"/"difficult," and originally expressed the
meaning of "rare" or "uncommon and precious."

w–‘Žqx‚́u‚ ‚肪‚½‚«‚à‚́v‚ł́Au‚±‚̐¢‚É‚ ‚é‚Ì‚ª“‚¢v‚Æ‚¢‚¤ˆÓ–¡A‚‚܂èAu‰ß‚²‚µ‚É‚­‚¢v‚Æ‚¢‚Á‚½ˆÓ–¡‚Å‚à—p‚¢‚ç‚ê‚Ä‚¢‚éB

In [the scene] "Arigataki Mono" ["That Which is
Uncommon/Precious] ] of "Makura no Soushi" [The Pillow
Book] [see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pillow_Book], it is
also used to mean "it is difficult to be in this
world"; i.e., "difficult to spend [time in]."

’†¢‚É‚È‚èA•§‚ÌŽœ”ß‚È‚Ç‹Md‚Å“¾“ï‚¢‚à‚Ì‚ðŽ©•ª‚Í“¾‚Ä‚¢‚é‚Æ‚¢‚¤‚Æ‚±‚ë‚©‚çA@‹³“I‚ÈŠ´ŽÓ‚Ì‹CŽ‚¿‚ð‚¢‚¤‚悤‚É‚È‚èA‹ß¢ˆÈ~AŠ´ŽÓ‚̈Ӗ¡‚Æ‚µ‚Ĉê”Ê‚É‚àL‚ª‚Á‚½B

When medieval times arrived, from [the idea of]
charity of the Buddha, etc., in obtaining that which
is precious and difficult to obtain, it came to
express a feeling of gratitude, and in recent times
and later, it spread to general use as the meaning of
gratitude.

ƒ|ƒ‹ƒgƒKƒ‹Œê‚́uƒIƒuƒŠƒK[ƒhiobrigadojv‚©‚çAu‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚¤v‚ÆŒ¾‚¤‚悤‚É‚È‚Á‚½‚Æ‚¢‚¤‘­à‚ª‚ ‚邪Aƒ|ƒ‹ƒgƒKƒ‹l‚ª–K‚ê‚éˆÈ‘O‚©‚çŽg‚í‚ê‚Ä‚¢‚½Œ¾—t‚ªƒ|ƒ‹ƒgƒKƒ‹Œê‚É—R—ˆ‚·‚é‚Í‚¸‚Í‚È‚­AuƒIƒuƒŠƒK[ƒhv‚Ɓu‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚¤v‚̉¹‚ª‹ß‚¢‚Æ‚¢‚¤‚¾‚¯‚̘b‚ŁA’ö“x‚Ì’á‚¢‘­à‚Å‚ ‚éB

There is a myth that from "obrigado" of Portuguese,
people came to say "arigatou," but it cannot be the
case that a word used before Portuguese people [first]
visited Japan was derived from the Portuguese
language; it just so happens to be the case that the
sounds of "obrigado" and "arigatou" are similar, and
this is a vulgar myth.
- translated text ends immediately before this line -

Yoroshiku onegai itashimasu.

Arigatou gozaimasu.

Benjamin L. Russell

--- jerzy.karczmarczuk at info.unicaen.fr wrote:

> Chung-chieh Shan corrects me: 
> 
> >> PS. If you think that "arigato" is a genuine
> Japanese word, well, check
> >> how the appropriately translated word is spelled
> in Portuguese... 
> > 
> > I'm not sure what you mean by "genuine", but I
> suspect that whether
> > "arigato" is genuine does not depend on
> Portuguese.
> > http://linguistlist.org/issues/12/12-1871.html
> > http://linguistlist.org/issues/12/12-1906.html
>  
> 
> Yes, it seems that I have been one more victim of
> this red herring.
> In the cited issues of the linguistlist there is a
> nice discussion of that
> topic. It should be more widely known entre a gente
> falando portugues.
> Vou calar a boca... 
> 
> Gomen nasai. 
> 
> Jerzy Karczmarczuk 
> 
> 
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