[Haskell-cafe] Poll & plea: State of GUI & graphics libraries in Haskell

Wed Oct 2 06:23:21 UTC 2013

Thanks. I've just built GHC HEAD on Mac OS X Lion, and tested by
installing libraries with --enable-shared and loading a GLFW program
into GHCi. Using ghci -fno-ghci-sandbox, everything works great
including closing and restarting GL window multiple times. Can't wait
for the  official release of GHC 7.8!

On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 12:09 PM, Carter Schonwald
<carter.schonwald at gmail.com> wrote:
> thats the linker bug.
>
> the glfw stuff has been tested on ghc HEAD / 7.7 by folks on #haskell-game
> in recent memory. GHCI + foreign libs should work fine now (modulo thread
> local storage related thing).
>
> the historical element doesn't matter any more.
>
> To the best of my knowledge, all such issues should be gone. Anyone who
> cares about making sure GHCI+ gui libs play nice, PLEASE test with HEAD.
>
> the better this issue is properly tested (which i believe it has been), the
> more we can actually prevent it from happening. This requires people to test
> with HEAD GHCi now, rather than doing archaeology.
>
> anyone who cares, please play with GHCI in HEAD. If your lib doesn't work
> with ghci, please report a bug. It would be a new bug because it wont' be
> the previous reasons it hasnt' worked.
>
>
> tl;dr to the best of my knowledge this issue is resolved in HEAD. Test HEAD.
> Help us make sure it stays resolved by testing HEAD.
>
> thanks
> -Carter
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Paul Liu <ninegua at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I reported a problem with statically linked GLFW library on Mac OS X
>> Lion in this thread:
>>
>> http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell-cafe/2012-January/097355.html
>>
>> I do not know why this is broken on Mac OS X Lion, but not on Linux or
>> Windows. There was an EnableGUI hack for GHC 7.2 (and previous
>> versions) and OS X version before Lion, but it no longer works. So I'm
>> not sure if it is OS X Lion, or GLFW, or GHC, or a combination of them
>> that caused this problem.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Paul Liu
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 7:04 AM, Carter Schonwald
>> <carter.schonwald at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Hey simon, the two issues that have recurrently bit ghci interaction
>> > with
>> > foreign GUI libs are
>> > 1) the ghci linker.  This is fixed in head by now having ghci use the
>> > system
>> > linker
>> > 2) some GUI libs require thread local state, and ghci has a flag for
>> > that
>> > 3)  I'm not aware of anyone reporting newly broken libs wrt GUI bindings
>> > when 7.6 rolled out.  The only fix that's relevant to 7.8 is the
>> > dylinker
>> > bit, but that would have been a problem historically too.
>> >
>> > I believe a number of folks in #haskell-game have recently tested point
>> > one.
>> > (Though I should ask to double check)
>> >
>> > At the very least, I'm not aware of hearing of such a 7.6 specific ghci
>> > breakage before.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tuesday, October 1, 2013, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Dear GHC devs
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> See below (in red).  I do not know the details of this, but it sounds
>> >> like
>> >> a pretty serious problem, and it used to work.  Is whatever-it-is
>> >> confirmed
>> >> fixed in 7.8?  Do we have a test that?ll trip if it breaks again?  (I?m
>> >> guessing that the latter might be hard.)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Simon
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: Haskell-Cafe [mailto:haskell-cafe-bounces at haskell.org] On Behalf
>> >> Of
>> >> Paul Liu
>> >> Sent: 30 September 2013 07:18
>> >> To: Conal Elliott
>> >> Cc: Haskell Cafe
>> >> Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Poll & plea: State of GUI & graphics
>> >> libraries
>> >> in Haskell
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Conal,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I wasn't able to make it to last Saturday's FARM track, but I think
>> >>
>> >> there was a good chance that Paul would have demonstrated his Euterpea
>> >>
>> >> music library, which includes a GUI interface (called MUI) written on
>> >>
>> >> top of GLFW. I wrote its initial implementation (around 2009?) with a
>> >>
>> >> monadic interface that let you wire together UI components with
>> >>
>> >> signals (I believe Dan later wrote an arrow interface, but I could be
>> >>
>> >> wrong). It was actually inspired by the ideas behind your Phooey UI
>> >>
>> >> library. It should be very easy to extract this part out as a
>> >>
>> >> standalone package if there is enough interest.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> The only issue with it (and all other UI libraries) is that it doesn't
>> >>
>> >> play nicely in GHCi. It used to work pretty well with GHC 7.2 and 7.4
>> >>
>> >> on almost all platforms (Mac needs an extra hack), but GHC 7.6 broke
>> >>
>> >> Mac (and perhaps Windows too). GHC 7.8 supposedly should fix this
>> >>
>> >> problem.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> BTW, as also the author of the GLFW library on HackageDB, I've done
>> >>
>> >> barely minimal to keep this Haskell binding afloat. I'm actually
>> >>
>> >> leaning towards GLFW-b library, which is better maintained, and
>> >>
>> >> provides similar binding for GLFW C library but with a saner interface
>> >>
>> >> (no dependency on the OpenGL library, for example). If you don't need
>> >>
>> >> the two extra things that GLFW does (choice of either dynamic or
>> >>
>> >> static linking to GLFW C, and an embedded bitmap font), I suggest you
>> >>
>> >> try out GLFW-b if you are only looking for a think graphics layer with
>> >>
>> >> input+window+OpenGL.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> The only thing keeping GLFW-b from becoming a good foundation for a
>> >>
>> >> pure Haskell UI lib is IMHO the lack of a light-weight,
>> >>
>> >> cross-platform, and full-featured font rendering solution. I believe
>> >>
>> >> many other libraries (including Diagram) are having the same problem.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 8:32 PM, Conal Elliott <conal at conal.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > I'm polling to see whether there are will and expertise to reboot
>> >> > graphics
>> >>
>> >> > and GUIs work in Haskell. I miss working on functional graphics and
>> >> > GUIs
>> >> > in
>> >>
>> >> > Haskell, as I've been blocked for several years (eight?) due to the
>> >> > absence
>> >>
>> >> > of low-level foundation libraries having the following properties:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> > * cross-platform,
>> >>
>> >> > * easily buildable,
>> >>
>> >> > * GHCi-friendly, and
>> >>
>> >> > * OpenGL-compatible.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> > The last several times I tried Gtk2hs, I was unable to compile it on
>> >> > my
>> >> > Mac.
>> >>
>> >> > Years ago when I was able to compile, the GUIs looked and interacted
>> >> > like a
>> >>
>> >> > Linux app, which made them awkward and upleasant to use. wxHaskell
>> >> > (whose
>> >>
>> >> > API and visual appearance I prefered) has for years been incompatible
>> >> > with
>> >>
>> >> > GHCi, in that the second time I open a top-level window, the host
>> >> > process
>> >>
>> >> > (GHCi) dies abruptly. Since my GUI & graphics programs are often
>> >> > one-liners,
>> >>
>> >> > and I tend to experiment a lot, using a full compilation greatly
>> >> > thwarts
>> >> > my
>> >>
>> >> > flow. For many years, I've thought that the situation would
>> >> > eventually
>> >>
>> >> > improve, since I'm far from the only person who wants GUIs or
>> >> > graphics
>> >> > from
>> >>
>> >> > Haskell.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> > About three years ago, I built a modern replacement of my old Pan and
>> >>
>> >> > V
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > ghc-devs mailing list
>> > ghc-devs at haskell.org
>> > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/ghc-devs
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Paul Liu
>
>

-- 
Regards,
Paul Liu